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View Full Version : How do you tell Christian music from secular music?


Orpheus42
07-28-02, 03:58 PM
What are the boundaries, are there exceptions to those boundaries? Does a song specifically have to be about God or Jesus or salvation to fit the "Christian" mold, or can songs be about basic Christian principles? Is a "Christian recording label" required (or even, is it all that is required) for the claim?

Please don't feel you have to answer all questions, or even that you have to limit your responses to only these questions. Any related discussion is welcome.

Peace, Love, and Jesus Christ,

Jason

Vinnie
07-28-02, 04:06 PM
I know Metallica's "The God that failed" definately AINT Christian ;)

Orpheus42
07-28-02, 04:08 PM
*hands Vinnie a "genius" sticker* ;)

Avatarus
07-28-02, 05:03 PM
Gee... and "God hates us all" by Slayer doesn't fit the Christian mold either... I wonder why... :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

Avatarus

Nicole
07-28-02, 05:14 PM
I would think that there is another category besides just "Christian" and "Secular"


something that's not really either - I've heard it called "mainstream"


I would define Christian music as that which glorifies God.


Secular as that which does the opposite.


then - there's all the other stuff. Like, oh, for example. You couldn't really call "Marry Had a Little Lamb" Christian per se, but it's not really Secular either. Its just there.
(like my example? :D)

and then there are instrumentals and stuff. (Though, personally those are Christian to me because even the sound of pure music always directs my thoughts towards God.)


I think it all comes down to whether or not it glorifies God or not. If a song is full of worthless profanity and vulgarity - I dont' care if they say "God loves you" a million times in the song - I'm still not going to see it as Christian.

enough of my rambling now :)

Subtotal
07-28-02, 07:23 PM
I usually just base it on what the band says. There are lots of bands who have spiritual lyrics, but are not Christian bands at all. So, if you are unsure, the best idea is the go to the source yourself and find out.

Nampula
07-29-02, 02:08 AM
i don't know that you can "box" music like that.. can a song be Christian if the singer or writer aren't? what if a Christian writes a song that has no overt mention of God or Christ-- is it a Christian lyric by default? what if it mentions only God, or even just spirituality? we often like to accuse those songs of being "Christian." what if the words are vague, with no real mention of God or Christ, but the writer uses metaphors to blatantly represent the two?

i don't think that there is a real division between secular & Christian music... if there is, then i'd say all music that doesn't overtly mention Christ is secular-- including mary had a little lamb.

as it is, i think that a song's spiritual level is determined by the listener, not just the writer & singer.

just to make an example: there's a song by extreme called "hole in my heart." the song is about a girl, & the chorus says, "there's a hole in my heart that can only be filled by you." the cd it's on is called porno grafitti, yet i find that particular song to be one of the best lyrical representations of Christ i've ever heard..

Vinnie
07-29-02, 12:28 PM
"""""""""i don't think that there is a real division between secular & Christian music"""""""""

I think in some areas the line is fuzzy and it of course depends on how we define "Christian music" and "secular music". As I will define them below the line is less fuzzy

Of course, there is a VERY FINELY DRAWN LINE between 'Shout to the Lord' and Metallica's 'The God that Failed.' Just read the lyrics of each. Its harder in regards to music like "Creed's" or of just love songs on the radio. If you define Chrristian music as music by a professing Christian band then Creed is out. If you define it as music that has Christian themes and/or a positive Christian message then Creed is in and so would a lot of other songs found on the radio and stuff.

I understand Christian music as coming from groups that profess to be Christian and put forth Christian CDs but I won't limit it and say that the only "Christian music" is found from these groups. Secular artists can produce "Christian music" as well.

Anne
07-29-02, 01:26 PM
Well, I don't usually post in here :) But, just as an example, my husband and I took our boys to see Spirit-Stallion of the Cimmeron. Bryan Adams did the soundtrack to that movie and there are some really awesome songs in it. Songs that aren't necessarly meant to be 'christian' but definately could be.

Some of the songs were so powerful and spiritual that they made me cry. (I know, I know, it is a cartoon!) LOL! So, IMHO secular music can be touching and spiritual depending on the heart you hear it with. I think we can see God in alot of things that most wouldn't consider 'christian'. It is just a matter of being aware and keeping our eyes and ears open.

God Bless, Anne

Ashwee
07-29-02, 05:15 PM
Originally posted by Nicole
then - there's all the other stuff. Like, oh, for example. You couldn't really call "Marry Had a Little Lamb" Christian per se, but it's not really Secular either. Its just there.
(like my example? :D)

Now.... if only you could have chosen the Itsy Bitsy Spider for this analogy.

Here are the lyrics as follows:

Mary had a little lamb, little lamb, little lamb,
Mary had a little lamb whoes fleece was white as snow.

Everywhere that Mary went, Mary went, Mary went,
Everywhere that Mary went, her lamb was sure to go.

It followed her to school one day, school one day, school one day,
It followed her to school one day, which was against the rules.

It made the children laugh and play, laugh and play, laugh and play,
It made the children laugh and play, to see a lamb at school.

Now that the lyrics are stated, let me give you my analysis on why the song could very well be Christian.

Stating the obvious, Mary, is a little girl, who goes to school
This Mary, had a lamb.

BUT! This could always be used not in the literal sense. We all know that Jesus is referred to as- The Lamb of God.
We all know that white is the color symbolizing purity. Therefore, a pure lamb.
Jesus, being the Lamb of God, was the perfect sacrifice, making Him white as snow, because of how pure He is.
In Matthew 28:20 it says: "And remember, I am with you always, to the end of the age." We could take this to mean that Jesus is always with you, and goes with you wherever you might go.
Wherever you might go, also includes, school. ;)

Due to recent elections of idiots into the political system, we all know that Jesus is no longer allowed in school. Its against the rules.
Mary brought a lamb to school, which was against the rules. Jesus cant be brought to school, because its against the rules.

Now for the children laughing and playing because Jesus was there....
1 Peter 1:8 "you believe in him and are filled with inexpressible and glorious joy"
That explains the joy and happiness you have when you have Jesus. The children had Jesus, therefor they laughed and played.




Ah... the lovely results of utter boredom. ;)

Nicole
07-29-02, 05:22 PM
:rofl:


- I've actually heard something similar to that before

Ashwee
07-29-02, 05:23 PM
Dangnt.... :wah:

Ashwee
07-29-02, 05:37 PM
Originally posted by Ashwee

Now.... if only you could have chosen the Itsy Bitsy Spider for this analogy.




Oh, but on second thought, you shouldnt have chosen this one either.

The Itsy Bitsy Spider is also Christian....

My reasoning for The Itsy Bitsy Spider to be a Christian song.

Here are the lyrics:

The itsy bitsy spider went up the water spout.
Down came the rain, and washed the spider out.
Out came the sun, and dried up all the rain.
And the itsy bitsy spider climbed up the spout again.

Alright, upon examination, you see the sun helping the spider complete his task. This must mean they are incahoots with eachother. This will come in handly later on in this explanation.

We can gather that the spider is none other, but the Great Satan.
Reason number one: Hes coming from the bottom, upwards. We all know the classic representation of Satan living below the ground. Hence, He must climb UP to get somewhere.
Reason number two: Spiders are always represented as evil. In movies, stories, songs, etc.

Now, we can also gather that Jesus is the rain.
Reason number one: We all know the classic representation of Heaven being above the clouds. Rain falls from the clouds. Rain is coming from heaven, hence, being sent by Jesus.
Reason number two: The rain weakens the spider. Another classic representation of Jesus overpowering Satan.

Now that we have gathered that Satan is the Spider, and Jesus is the rain, we now must figure out why the Sun and the Spider are incahoots.

I figure that the Sun and Spider are the same thing, Satan. The Sun is extremely hot, and has huge huge boils of fire all over it. Fire is also associated with Hell, the place where Satan lives. The Sun also helps out the spider, making him either a Satan Worshipper, or Satan himself.

The battle of spider trying to go up the spout again, is none other than Satans great attempt at tempting us humans. Yes, we are the spout.

Orpheus42
07-29-02, 05:43 PM
That's odd... I've always identified pretty well with the Spider ;)

I like the discussion of that song I read in Everything I Need to Know I Learned in Kindergarten.

But your point is well-taken.

Ashwee
07-29-02, 05:45 PM
I have WAY too much time.


I want to do more too! LOL!

Nicole
07-29-02, 05:57 PM
:rofl:

I must say I always indentified with the spider a bit more myself


hence:

Satan is the rain - we are the spider - the rain knocks us off, but the SON dries it up and we get to start climbing again

dorfsmith
07-29-02, 06:57 PM
Alegory, beautiful alegory. I love your take on those nursery rhymes.


Check out the lyrics from System Of A Down--Chop Suey! Are they Christian or not??? I think they could be and last night they gave me chills. I love that song.

Nirvana speaks to me more than any other secular band though. I often see how lost my secular friends are as I listen to Kobain's lyrics. I hear them calling for answers begging for a reason to live and I understand where they are coming from. We forget how lost the lost are until we listen to them. I know a 9 year old kid who cuts his arms as a way to get attention. I know a girl who sliced her wrists. I've know four people who shot themselves in the head. If I had understood them or listened to them would I have been able to help them??? Nirvana tunes me in to their silent screams.